Balboa Park 2

I found myself in Balboa Park with the family.  While they were busy, I wandered around, and happened upon a little booth that looked like a religious thing.  As it happens, it was an atheist group.  I was pleased to see them out and about, and chatted a bit about what they were doing, what their goals were, what it was like to talk to people who come up and challenge them, etc.  I was pleased to see some general representation of the atheist community, and hope that they are able to inform the public about what they are all about.

As one of them said, most of what people learn about atheists come from their pastors, and that might be a slanted view.  So they enjoy reconciling those differences when people come to chat with them, and finding out exactly where they disagree.

Further up the road, I came across a tent with people handing out free water.  The water had bible verses on it.  I approached, and one guy greeted me warmly and asked if I had any questions.

So I asked him my question.  I said that I want to go to heaven, and I don't want to go to hell.  What do I need to do to make that happen?  This is indeed an honest question of mine.

He seemed a little taken aback, and showed me his water bottle, with John 3:16 on it, and read it to me.  Whoever believes in Jesus will have everlasting life.

So all I have to do is believe in Jesus, and I'll go to heaven?  That's it?  It doesn't matter what I do?

He sort of turned back to the water bottle, then stumbled around a little.  I let him off the hook, saying that I was "playing dumb", but that I really was interested in the answer.

He called over someone whose name was close to Janet.  I posed the same question to her, and she responded back with questions of her own, asking about my religious upbringing and background.  I shared that with her, but at the same time questioned why that mattered.  She just wanted to know where I was coming from, she said.

She then asked if she could share her personal testimony with me.  Sure, knock yourself out.  She said she grew up godless, and got into lots of trouble as a kid.  And when she got older, and got married, she had miscarriages.  I sympathized.  But then she got pregnant, and she went in for that ultrasound, and was so impressed by the miracle of birth, and started saying things like "only through the grace of God could that happen".  That's where I stopped her.  How do we KNOW that it's through the grace of God?

She then went to the old "well look around... look at the sky, look at the TREES!".  I knew I was in trouble when she went to the trees line.  How do you think this all got here?  In my head I was labeling this as a classic "argument from ignorance".  "We don't know how this got here, therefore God."  The first guy piped in, saying that I was a software developer, and it was just like writing computer programs.

I said I was still having problems understanding.  She then went through the Ray Comfort "have you ever told a lie?  Have you ever stolen something?"  I even completed her next thought, saying that I'd looked upon a women with lust.  Her expression was like "Oh, you've heard this before?!"  She asked about sin, and I said that sin was such a loaded word.  It basically presupposes a god and his rules.  I said that I don't really believe in sin as such, since I'm not yet convinced that there is a god to back it up.

At some point, she asked me if I was "from that other booth".  I told her I was not, and really did try to impress upon her that I wasn't pulling her leg or jerking her around.  I was asking honest questions, and really was interested in hearing her answers, which was the truth.

In an effort to try to get her to understand my point of view, I said "Ok, let's say that I tell you about a different God.  Call him God2.  Do you believe in God2?"  Of course she didn't.  She asked if this god sent Jesus to earth to die for our sins.  I said triumphantly "No, but he sent his son Jesus2!"  The other guy piped up about needing evidence, like fulfilled prophecies.  I said that in the Bible2, there was a book of Isiah2 with fulfilled prophecies.  Did they believe me now?  Sadly, they did not.  I had a hard time getting them to grasp my rhetorical point, but I think they finally got there in the end.  Was there anything I could tell them that would make them believe in God2?  No.  Was there anything they could tell me that would make me believe in God?  She finally admitted that it "just comes down to faith", and that I'd basically need to wait for some sort of revelation.  That, to me, is the end of an intellectual conversation, so I politely disentangled myself and left.

All in all, it was a really interesting conversation, and I enjoyed it.

Alcohol

A Mormon friend asked on Facebook “Why do people drink?”  I don’t think she was asking rhetorically, but really wanted to know the motivations behind people who drink alcohol.  I think the answers were all pretty standard:  tasted, relaxation, fun.  A couple non-drinkers piped in, one of whom said there’s nothing you can get from booze that you can’t get from Yoohoo.  I thought that was cute.

A more interesting question to me is why don’t Mormon’s drink?  I’ve heard a few answers.  If you search online, you’ll quickly discover the “Word of Wisdom”, a section of one of the LDS scriptures (D&C 89).  “Strong drinks” are not for the belly, nor are “hot drinks”.  That’s the literal reading, at least.

After skimming some commentary, it all gets sort of fuzzy.  These are not “thou shalt not” type commandments, but just kind of suggestions.  “Hot drinks” doesn’t mean ALL hot drinks, it just means coffee and tea.  This could be interpreted to actually mean “caffeine”, but that’s not actually called out specifically.  So there’s a lot of various ways to read this, which is probably why different Mormons feel comfortable eating and drinking different things.

One thing I read in a number of places is that it that makes them stand apart from everyone else.  I can respect that, I guess, although I'm not sure I understand the point.  Another article said that people who can deny addictive things will be stronger and more able to deny other evils, so maybe it’s more an exercise in restraint just for the sake of resisting something, anything.  This makes some sense, I guess.

As I was pondering this, I remembered the story of the great flood and Noah.  God saw the world was full of wickedness, and he regretted making us.  That’s funny to me.  In any case, he decided to wipe us all out, except for Noah.  Noah was a righteous and blameless man.  You know the story.

Well what’s the first thing in the Bible after the story of the Flood?  The very first thing he does is plant a vineyard, make wine, and get naked and drunk.

There are a few conclusions we can draw from this:

1)  God is ok with people drinking (since he chose Noah because of how good and righteous he was)

2)  Noah used to be a good guy, but changed his behavior after the flood (which God neglected to foresee, I guess)

3)  Something else: the stories are metaphorical or allegorical.

4)  This is fiction

I don’t really know what to draw from it, but it is an interesting little intersection of God and a righteous man and alcohol. 

My Great Grandmother

My dad recently recounted a story that his grandmother Eva told him when he was younger.  Eva was raised in the strict household of a Methodist minister and his wife.  The mother was very strict about not doing any work on Sunday, or else the devil would come.  “Work” included even mundane tasks like using scissors to cut paper.

Eva and her sister decided to test out this “truth” one Sunday.  They went up into their attic, and one of the girls cut up some paper while the other stood watch and looked out for the devil.  He didn’t appear.

I love this story.  It’s skepticism in its purest form.  We have this idea that is presented as fact, but is it really true?  Can we come up with some way to test it?  And what brave young girls to put their own lives and salvation on the line to conduct this experiment.

I thought it was great, and felt proud to be descended from such stock.

Prayer, Part 2

Two weeks ago, I prayed for a sign.

One week ago, I happened to find thing on my body that was of some medical concern.  I was pretty worried about this, and decided I should probably call the doctor, but decided to wait a couple days to see if it changed or went away.  Luckily, it did go away and now it's gone (like, 100% gone).

Also in the last two weeks, there have been some crazy meteor sightings (Cuba and Russia), as well as this asteroid flyby.

Are these the signs from God that I was praying for?  Particularly the first one...  is this a sign from the heavens that says "I gave you life, and I can take it away at a moments notice"?  Or is it just a coincidence?  How on earth can I possibly make that determination?  Or is there even such a thing as a "coincidence"?

Prayer

I prayed last night.  Honestly and sincerely.  I said that I knew that my mind had been closed to God, but that I earnestly wanted to learn the truth.  I said that God has used so many people for His glory throughout the years, and that I hoped that he could use me in a similar way.  What a wonderful prophet I would be, the atheist turned believer!  I prayed that my eyes would be opened and my heart would be opened to His holy spirit, in Jesus' name, amen.

Now what?

Ray Lewis

Ray Lewis gave an impassioned speech after his recent AFC Championship victory.

“When you sacrifice something for God… He will give you anything that your heart desires… if it aligns with His will.”

He then talks about his challenges and torn triceps, but “God just kept telling me that ‘no weapon formed against me shall prosper…  no weapon formed against my team shall prosper.’  Anytime you trust in God, man can’t tell you what you can’t do.”

Regarding the sign predicting his retirement, he says “Man can’t dictate that… God dictates that”, and then he’s whisked away.

I love prayer in sports.  It brings up so many interesting issues, it’s almost overwhelming for me.

First:  God will give you anything your heart desires…

Here’s an interesting Bible verse:

21 Jesus replied, “Truly I tell you, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, ‘Go, throw yourself into the sea,’ and it will be done. 22 If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer.”

Does anyone believe this?  Does anyone, even the most holy and faithful and repentant, believe that they can actually wish for a mountain to throw itself into the sea, and that it will actually happen?

“… if it aligns with his will.”

Ahh.  Here’s the rub.  God answers prayers, and sometimes the answer is “no”.  If you are holy and faithful and you pray for something, and that something doesn’t happen, either it didn’t align with God’s will, or you’re not has faithful as you thought you were.  Seriously, if part of the success of the prayer is that you must not have any doubt, and you pray for something impossible and it doesn’t happen, wouldn’t that only increase your doubt? 

Another interesting question:  Does ANYTHING happen that is against God’s will?  It strikes me that the answer must be “yes”.  I think Christian theology is all about man’s free will, choosing to sin, and repentance and redemption through the shed blood of Jesus.  But that implies that God is not omnipotent/omniscient/omnipresent, doesn’t it?

Why Won't God Heal Amputees covers this topic in much greater detail than I could.  It’s a good site to browse around.

Secondly:  Isn’t this terribly pompous and egotistical of the winning team/player?

Mr. Lewis is saying that his team won because he sacrificed so much and God willed it to happen.  But what about the losing team?  Isn’t possible that they sacrificed equally as much, if not more?  What if there was someone that was equally impassioned on the losing team.  What is their take on the loss?  What if the Ravens ended up losing because of some blown call by the refs?  What would Ray’s post-game speech be?  The only possible thing I could imagine is that it would be something about how God’s will was done.  If it’s all up to God, then why do players even bother to work out and train?  Why even play the game at all?

If I have a headache and I take an aspirin and pray for the headache to go away, and in half an hour I feel much better, what does that mean?  Was it the prayer or the aspirin?

I once watched a show about MMA fighters.  Before the show, both fighters sincerely prayed for victory.  It made for a very exciting fight.  Whose prayer would God answer?!  It was like a mini holy war.

“God just kept telling me that ‘no weapon formed against me shall prosper…  no weapon formed against my team shall prosper.’”

Again, what if he lost?  Or rather, what if someone who sincerely believed this was on a losing team?

He’s just emotional and obviously sincere in his belief, but it makes absolutely no sense to me.  Which is part of the reason I write in this blog… to try to reconcile that gap. 

Story time!

In spite of her troubled past, Jessica was a highly successful high school student.  She escaped a troubled home life and abusive step-father by diving into her schoolwork.  As a result, she earned a full-ride scholarship to a well respected university, and flourished in college life.

She met Todd at a party and was immediately smitten.  In contrast to Jessica, everything seemed to come easily to Todd.  He was well liked, a star athlete, and on the student council.

At the party, Jessica had a bit too much to drink, and is quick to accept a ride home from Todd.  Instead of taking her home, though, they drive to a lookout point.  She tries to say no, but he’s too strong and powerful, and he rapes her.

In the months following Jessica deals with severe depression.  She was saving her first time for marriage, and is too embarrassed to go to the police.  Word gets around, and she gets branded a slut.  She loses her faith and stops going to church.  How could God have let something like this happen?  When she finally can’t take it anymore, she hangs herself with a belt in her closet.

After her death, Todd feels guilt.  He becomes more involved in his church, and earnestly prays for forgiveness.  He feels like his prayers are answered, and considers himself “born again”.  A month later, he is tragically hit by a random drunk driver while walking home from the library and killed instantly.

This is a contrived story, but it’s plausible, isn’t it?

Some questions:

Would you consider Jessica to be the victim of a crime?

Would you consider Todd to be a criminal?

Who, if anyone, is in heaven?

Who, if anyone, is condemned to hell?